[pestes]

When it rains, it pours. Or, when it leaks air ... it blows?

Seems like I have an air issue in the front on top of my leaking solenoid valve in the back. I had convinced myself that the front was dropping as a result of the left rear dropping due to the valve leak back there. But I've now proven that's just not the case.

With no solenoids engaged, the front of the coach stays up. But when I go to travel mode, only the left side drops. The right side stays at a proper travel height.

I propped up the front of the coach and tried poking around with my Whisper, but can't pinpoint anything as it's hard to get very far under the front.

Looking for ideas on what it might be. On front there's only a single HCV, isn't there? So I'm thinking it's not that being that the passenger side stays up.

Also trying to figure out how I can rig the coach to drive it about 5 miles on back roads to a shop in order to be able to get under there.

Being that it only loses air in travel mode - would it be a terrible idea to manually get the height to approximately ride height and then disconnect the travel solenoids? I do not have an override switch on my dash. As soon as I start moving more than a crawl, the HWH automatically goes to travel mode.

[Jack Houpe]

Sounds like left rear ride height valve is out of adjustment or defective. You'll need someone with more knowledge than I have to tell you how to travel with the with the HWH bypassed.

[hypoxia]

Sounds like left rear ride height valve is out of adjustment or defective. 

I agree with Jack.  On my 2020P chassis the rear height control valves are in front of the drive tire and somewhat accessible without crawling under the coach.

HWH Ride Height Manual-We have Valid.pdf Size: 334.86 KB  Downloads: 12

[pestes]

That was my original theory as well.

But, I think I've proven to myself that it's not the rear HCV.

Due to a leaky valve, I have hotwired the rear six pack. I've connected the travel mode wires to the raise solenoids on the rear six pack. So, in travel mode, the rear actually raises all the way up on both sides right now.

But, in travel mode, as soon as I connect the travel mode solenoids on the front six pack (to the correct connections), the front left starts to drop. I can hear air escaping somewhere in the front as soon as I connect the solenoids.

In this scenario, the rear HCVs are not even in the picture.

[hypoxia]

HWH Systems Textbook I attached, Page 12 has a good description under "Travel Mode" and specifically discusses Newell vehicles. Have you seen that?

[pestes]

I have. I guess the one thing that I did not notice before though is the handbook shows 2 HCV’s in front and one in rear. It was my understanding that our Newells have 2 in the rear and 1 in front. Which is why I am thinking it odd that in the front only the left side drops and not both sides.

[Richard]

First me thinks you got the wiring reversed in your hot wiring diagnostic. Easy to do.

Are you willing to do some diagnostics, because I am having a hard time understanding what you are describing with dropping in travel mode.

With the engine running, and the coach in travel mode:
Does the coach come to the proper ride height?
What pressure do you read on the pressure gauges at the front?
If the coach does not come to the proper ride height please describe what it does.

With the engine off, but the key in the on position.
Starting with the coach at ride height.
Does the coach stay level? If not describe what happens.
What happens with the air gauges in the front? Important to comment on all both the brake and supply.
Do you hear air escaping at any location.

With the engine running and coach at ride height, place the coach in LEVEL mode, but don’t press any other buttons.
Does the coach stay level?
What happens with the air pressure gauges?

Last data.
Leave the coach in level mode and turn off the ignition.
What happens with the pressure gauges?
Does the coach stay level.

Here is a tidbit that will help understand why your hot wiring was not helpful. All of the travel solenoids are tied to the same terminal in the HWH control box. So when you energize one, you energize them all.

I can help if you will answer the questions above, cut and paste, write the answer by the question.

[pestes]

Hi Richard,

Answers inline.

First me thinks you got the wiring reversed in your hot wiring diagnostic. Easy to do.

This condition was present before I touched anything. Nothing had been touched on the six packs in quite a long time now prior to this other than the coach sitting idle for a few months this winter.

Are you willing to do some diagnostics, because I am having a hard time understanding what you are describing with dropping in travel mode.

I'm not at the coach at the moment, but have been through this a few times now, so this should all be accurate. Caveat for all of these responses. The front six pack is wired normal. The back six pack is wired such that the gray travel mode wires from the HWH are connected to the RAISE solenoids on the 6 pack. This is in order to a) Remove the HCV from the equation and b) prevent the rear from dropping due to the leaky solenoid valve I currently have in the rear.

---

With the engine running, and the coach in travel mode:
Does the coach come to the proper ride height?

No.

What pressure do you read on the pressure gauges at the front?

110 PSI on the aux gauge. Brakes at full pressure (110 I think)

If the coach does not come to the proper ride height please describe what it does.

Rear raises all the way up due to my hotwire. Front right comes to travel height. Front left drops all the way down.

---

With the engine off, but the key in the on position.
Starting with the coach at ride height.

(I'm starting from raised all the way up, as there's no way to start from proper ride height in the current situation)

Does the coach stay level? If not describe what happens.

Front left drops all the way down. Front right remains at present level. Rear left drops down due to the leaky valve.

What happens with the air gauges in the front? Important to comment on all both the brake and supply.

Aux gauge drops due to the leaky valve in the rear. Brakes remain at full pressure (110 PSI, if I remember correctly)

Do you hear air escaping at any location.

I hear the leaky valve in the rear. And also air escaping in the front as the front left drops.

----

With the engine running and coach at ride height, place the coach in LEVEL mode, but don’t press any other buttons.

(again, I'll start from raised all the way up as I cannot start from actual travel height)

Does the coach stay level?

Front remains at its present level. Left rear drops down due to the leaky valve.

What happens with the air pressure gauges?

Both gauges show full pressure.

Last data.
Leave the coach in level mode and turn off the ignition.
What happens with the pressure gauges?

Brake gauge stays full, aux gauge drops as air leaks from the rear valve.

Does the coach stay level.

Front stays at the same level. The rear left continues to drop.

[Richard]

Incorrect info on my part. Deleted.

[pestes]

 With this wiring, air pressure from the coach is continuously applied to the rear. Does the left rear stay up when you do this?

Yes, the left rear of the coach stays up with this. The leaky valve is still spewing air, but there's more coming in on the RAISE solenoid than leaking out the tag solenoid valve. This was my big hint that the front is not dropping because the rear is dropping. I've hardwired the rear to not drop, even with the leaking valve. Yet the front left still drops in travel mode, and only in travel mode. But not the right.

You have spoken of leaky valve and you can hear the valve. Are you talking about the ride height control valve located inside the dual drive tires? Or are you referring to the solenoid valve on the six pack?

No, sorry, this is the valve I mentioned on the post a few days ago, which appears to be part of the tag axle pressure control. I've climbed under the coach and traced that rear leak to that valve. No noise from the Whisper anywhere near the airbag itself.

The fact that the coach will not build air pressure when the travel solenoids are open says you have a MASSIVE leak in the air bag system.

The coach does build pressure with the engine running, in all scenarios. With the engine off, pressure drops no matter what due to the valve leak in the rear. That valve is always in play on the tag axle, regardless of the status of the 6 pack solenoids, so it always drains any supply.


As I understand the plumbing, the 2 travel solenoids in the front 6 pack both take the output of the HCV and connect it to the airbags. The fact that the left drops and the right does not makes me think that there must be check valves after the split from the HCV before the 6 pack and that my leak must be between the left check valve and the 6 pack.