[roadappels]

After traveling 6500 miles and being worn out I am taken to my coach that my cousin was supposedly storing in a heated warehouse and find it in a barn that has no heat...we checked starter batteries and they were extremely low on water which I promptly brought to correct level with distilled water...put it on a slow charge charger overnight and am headed back to barn to see if she will crank...I checked the two agm house batteries and they have bulged  ( I suspect overcharged a few too many times and the one bad one hurt the other) My question or concerns are if it is 15 degrees for the last two weeks in this barn then will the fuel be affected? If the batteries are dead will my preheater work?  How should I heat up the engine if the preheater is not working? Then once we get started I sure hope she airs up...I may be asking how to get antifreeze into air system too as the coach has no air at the moment.... I have 9 days to get this coach to Oklahoma and then I will have a year to work on her...I guess the positive is I get to live and work onher

Bill

[folivier]

Preheater works on 120volts so need either plugged in or generator running.
I had that happen to me over 1 month when I left it plugged in and charger going. 1 or 2 of the batteries went bad and caused the others to boil out all of the water. I added 14 gallons to the 6 batteries. That prompted my conversion to a LiFePO4 system.

[roadappels]

Forrest, two AGMs bubbled and won't hold charge...I pulled the starter batteries and had them tested and they are fine...The coach still will not turn over...I'm getting just a clicking noise when trying to start. when I disconnected the starter batteries I see that they are wired to the AGMs through a merge is there a way to just try and start coach with just starter batteries...does the inverter need to be disconnected at some point since those two agms are bad? I'm such a novice but I am looking for solutions to get the coach started....My other thought is that it has been in the cold for the past two weeks could the fuel have gelled due to the cold? Do I just leave it plugged into 110 wall outlet and turn on the preheat indefinitely? Should I get a kerosene blast heater to try and warm the block? I figure I have 3-4 days to get her up and running but it was 7 degrees at 10 am and not going to warm up til monday and that will be a high of 26... Any advice you all can give me is appreciated....moving to warmer weather is planned! I just want to try and go step by step...unfortunately the coach is stored 9 miles away from where I have internet and they parked me in so I can't get into my bays for tools etc..  How about the propane furnace with that run being hooked up to 110?

Bill

[ccjohnson]

Place a +/- 1500watt electric heater on the ground under engine. Wrap plastic sheeting around from bottom of coach to the ground. This will keep heat going up to the engine. May take 2-3 hrs to have it warm enough to crank right up. If possible, keep charger on batteries during this time span. Portable propane furnace would also work,but watch to make sure you don't catch anything on fire. Or at least make sure insurance is up to date. Cold weather sucks! We are in Pecos, TX and have an ice plug in 110 compressor discharge line somewhere.

[lbrachfe]

Sorry to hear Bill, I have NO cold weather experience of any kind, so dare not guess. I would go to Home Depot and buy an electric pipe wrap that keeps pipes from freezing and I would wrap the exposed engine areas with it in addition to a heater below. Good Luck..

[Richard]

Bill, the manual disconnect switch should take the house batts out of the starting situation but if you want to make absolutely sure disconnect the AGM positive and negative leads. Tape off the positive, so you don't create a short. Turn off your charger/inverter first. That will absolutely disconnect the chassis and house batts. I don't know what charger inverter is in that coach, but keep in mind, that many of them automatically default to charge when they are plugged into shore, or the gennie starts. So you may have to turn it off again.

The other thing that could have happened is the AGMs froze. Batteries can freeze if they are discharged. Either way they are toast.

Phone number is 817 223 2056. Glad to chat if you needed.

Good idea on the heater.

It is possible the fuel is gelled, the heater will help with that.

The two strokes do not like to crank cold. The heater will help with that.

[LynnJeff]

Bill

Are you anyplace where you could rent a portable generator large to drag/pull over to the bus which would give you 30 or 50 amp service which would let you plug in and turn on your block heater and/or enough juice to crank it over?

[77newell]

My 93 39ft coach will turn over but not start without preheat when the temperature is below freezing. If yours is not turning over then neither the cold nor possible gelled fuel is the immediate problem. If indeed the starting batteries are good AND fully charged, then you have some kind of electrical problem, likely a bad or corroded connection somewhere. Get your handy voltmeter out and measure voltage starting from the batteries and going to the starter itself. If those are all reading 12+ volts when the key is switched to the "start" position, then you have a ground problem. One way to find a ground problem is to engage the system and measure voltage between battery "-" and the grounding wiring starting at the engine. You will have 12 volts showing up in the ground system until you reach the point where the bad connection is. Until you get the starter rolling the engine over everything else is irrelevant.

You could also disconnect the house batteries as described above. Engage the "merge" solenoid and check to make sure it is engaged. I believe it's possible to start the generator in this configuration. If it cranks without hesitation then you will still need to figure out why the drive engine starter doesn't engage. If it doesn't then you know there is an electrical problem somewhere close to the batteries, or so I believe.

Your drive engine preheater is powered as Forest said by the top receptical on the 120v box mounted on the forward side of passenger side engine compartment. You must be connected to 120v or have the generator running AND have the preheat switch above the driver's head (if the same as my coach). It will take several hours of preheat before the engine is warmed enough to start. With the preheat operating I have been able to start the engine down to 3 degrees (why the heck anyone wants to travel when it's that cold is a mystery but I've done it).

If the fuel in the tanks was purchased in the summer it is possible that it will gel. You can buy additives by several vendors that will dissolve the gel. I would add that to the tanks prior to cranking. I've never had a gel problem even with "summer' fuel being used in the winter but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

If the fuel has been sitting for some time I would install new fuel filters filled with good clean fuel. I would have a few extras in case algae has grown in the tank. My coach as set outside for months and I've never had algae but you want to be prepared.

As for airbrake antifreeze. On my 77 coach there was no air drier after the compressor on the engine. Passing through an ice storm (really dumb move) into really cold weather I did have problems with my air brakes. Once I installed an air drier I never had further problems in freezing conditions. A well maintained modern drier will remove enough moisture to keep you safe. If I ever do develop a problem my plan is to dump the air in the system and pour some air brake antifreeze down the exit line from the drier pressurize the system and then pump the brakes to move it through the system. I don't know if that will work but it's worth a try if you find you have problems, but I would do nothing until you know you have a problem with icing. The more you mess with things that aren't broke the more likely things are to break.

[folivier]

Jon, it was -14 degrees last night and about 7 today where Bill is. Good question is how long would the preheater take to warm up the engine and oil to start and would the fuel be gelled at those temps?

[77newell]

When I used to drive a highway bus that I kept overnight next to the barn, I plugged it in at night and it started in the morning. Some winter mornings were in the -14 degree range.

As to what temperature the fuel will gel, that would depend on how much of it is winter fuel and if summer how much wax (I think it is) it has in it. Perhaps a quick way to tell would be to pull a filter and see how it pour out, or siphon some fuel out of the tank and see what it looks like. I would think that if there is gel the first filter is most likely the pinch point. But hey, I've started the engine on the 77 coach at -4 with summer fuel and had no problems. I know others who had problems at 10.

In addition to heating the engine with the coolant heater would be to drain the oil and heat it hot and then dump it back in the engine and quickly start it. But, he needs to know the starter is working as it should first. Even at -14 I would expect to hear more than "click" when the starter switch is hit. If the remote start switch in the rear panel is used you should see the radiator fan move, albeit veeerrrryyy slowly. That would say the starter is working.