[encantotom]

i have been buying the oreillys lead acid batteries for starting. that said, 8d's are 8d's i have no brand allegiance. thats why for agm's i dont pay the premium for lifelines. a 50 percent plus premium is not worth it to me.

i buy alot of batteries there (for gurus who pop in here in wittmann) and myself so they knock quite a bit off for me. i think i paid like 195 a few months ago.

in my opinion, it is nuts to keep the batteries merged all the time. if your charger is working right, then it will charge your house batteries and the echo charger (or amp l start) will keep your starting batteries charged when sitting. if you keep your merge or emergency start switch on.....you will run both banks of batteries down potentially and now you are really stuck.

https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/b/fle...tery&pos=1

tom

[The Bus Crew]

I have experienced the issue with leaving batteries merged while plugged into a shoreline. My house batteries died when it was around 95 degrees and then they drained my start batteries. I had to pull the start batteries to take them to a shop to get charged just to start coach. Also had to replace house batteries which was bad timing as I knew they were getting old and was looking into lithium but when this happened I needed the batteries right then so I put lead acid back in.

Part of my plan is to add a battery tender from house to start batteries as Tom and several others have suggested now.

But I no longer leave merge on except for a day or two at a time.

[Guy]

Ok gang help me out one this one. I am sure it is wrong, but,,,, although we are full time, we often are tethered to shore power for long periods of time. In these instances I keep the batteries merged, and the batteries seem to keep 13.2 to 13.4 volts. Add water every 6 months although they have never been low enough to expose lead plates .Never have an issue starting, although we try to let the engine warm up to operating temp every few weeks if we are stationary. Opinions ? Going to migrate to agm in the next few weeks for both house and engine.

[encantotom]

something to consider. when you are merged, there is constant voltage to the coil on the merge relay. for fun go back and see how hot it is.

it is a cole hersee 24106 continuous duty solenoid. so it can certainly stay on for long periods of time. is that 6 months at a time? seems like it can be because you are doing it. that is probably why newell recommends changing it once a year. i have changed mine once and keep a spare.

i personally dont like to have it on for months at a time. just my personal choice. i helped someone this week who had new starting batteries that were dead. (they were not plugged in) and when i had them check the merge switch (on theirs....emergency start) it was on and their house batteries were bad and drained the starting batteries.

the nice thing about using the AMP L START http://www.lslproducts.net/ALS_Overview_Page.html is that as long as the house batteries are charged or charging it will "steal" power from them to charge the starting batteries. it is smart enough to turn itself on and off based on the conditions of the house batteries. starting in the mid 90's and up they used a xantrex echocharger and it is a little less smart version of the amp l start.

so, no real wrong answer, you just have to understand what you are doing and manage to it.

the other thing in my case is i have agm batteries for the coach side and lead acid on the starting batteries.

when i set up the magnum inverter charger it asks for how many amp hours is your battery bank. if i had the battery banks merged, the answer would be different if i did not.

but i would be curious to know how warm your merge relay is from being on for months at a time.

later

tom

[Richard]

I’ll cut to the chase scene.

Don’t keep them merged. Install some sort of device already mentioned to trickle charge the start batteries. By merging them, you run the risk of killing all the batteries in the coach if you lose pedestal power and you are not around the coach for a day or two. Second, if you have deep cycle batteries for the house and regular cranking batteries for the engine, the engine batteries are being cycled as deep discharge when you have them merged. They are not designed for that.

Plus if merged, then you use the alternator to charge the house batteries. Yeah, I know ALL class A’s advertise that as a feature, but it’s not a great idea. It is a good way to fry the alternator if the house batteries are pretty low when you start your drive.

Stop cranking your engine and letting it idle. Does more harm than good, Diesel engine will never get hot enough to boil off the moisture while idling. If you want to put it on the road for 30 miles, that’s a great idea, but not sitting and idling. When you idle a diesel, the engine never gets hot enough for complete combustion. Two things happen, the first is that carbon builds up in the cylinders and around the injector tip. The second is the unturned diesel washes down the engine oil coating on the cylinder walls thereby increasing engine wear. So the impact of extended idling is moisture in the oil, moisture in the exhaust system, diesel in the oil, and increased cylinder wear. I am not sayin that idling a diesel destroys it, but I am saying it doesn’t have the beneficial effect that you might think. Getting it out and driving it is a much better approach. That stirs all the fluids, lubricates all the seals, and gets the tires hot which helps them resist UV.

[encantotom]

ok.....yea, what he said

tom

[Guy]

Thanks for the guidance. To answer Tom's question about the Cole Hershey solenoid, it was runnung 25 degrees above ambient. I will take your and Richard's advice on that, along with installing a new one. Todd included 3 new spares when I bought it.

I like the battery tender idea. I need to come up with a spot to mount it. My engine batteries are split, one in front of each rear wheel, House batteries, ( 2 8D ) are mounted in a narrow compartment behind the drivers front tire. They are vertically stacked.

So far this year we are sporting new tires on the Geo Tracker which lives in the enclosed trailer when traveling, New Goodyear Endurance tires on the trailer which replaced tires made in a country that may have introduced a virus, all 6 new Goodyear  24.5 H tires on the "Hippy Bus", 4 new air bags on the rear of the coach, along with fresh filters, Allison transmisssion flluid and filters changed to synthetic, 40 wt Dello 100 and a whole lot of chassis grease. Next up will be some basement a/c work in the fall. The middle a/c under the counter by the door, has a fan that doesn't want to turn any more, just make noise and draw lots of amps. Capacitors are good, so I need to come up with a way to get that fan out. Looks like the Dometic has to be removed to get to it. Judging by the state of the wiring, there has need a bit of "service" work on the past on this one. Because of all the nice ducting by Newell, I am going to be the last man standing running basement air.

[Richard]

Guy, at the risk of derailing this thread. I love the Dometic basement air. They will freeze you out if working properly. It sounds like you condenser motor has gone out. It is the number one problem with that unit. The bushings wear, and the motor doesn’t start. When the condenser motor doesn’t start, the compressor develops high head pressure very quickly, hence the high amperage you see. Replacing the motor isn’t that hard. Usually there is enough copper line in the refrigeration lines to just slide the unit out far enough to get the top off of it. Look up the threads on replacing that motor. The original is a weird rpm, but a number of people have used a commonly available Grainger motor with a slightly different RPM with success. You do have to take saw or side grinder and “adjust” the length of the motor shaft.

[Guy]

Yes, I am sure it is toast. It gave me a hint earlier when it would not turn off. I have 3 basement airs. This is the middle unit. It is different that the other two, in that it is totally self contained. No lines running to an evaporator in an overhead area llike the front and rear units. This should work to my advantage. I have no problem modding a replacement motor. The extraction of the unit is my issue. I believe it was meant to be removed out the bottom of the coach as the access exterior door is too narrow, but somone, ( Newell ?) has welded the bottom support struts in . I have time on my hands and a 26 foot enclosed trailer with lots of tools. What could go wrong .

Update.... Mystery solved. It almost seems to simple ( Uh oh) Plan A. The unit is designed to be removed into the coach. Mounted on it's own piece of 3/4 "plywood, 120 volt incoming power with a grey quick disconnect connector which I have not seen anywhere else in this coach, 5 inch flex duct . , with easy to reach hose clamp. Remove thermostat wires, remove 2 drawers above, cabinet doors, cabinet 1/8 ' partition. If this fails proceed to plan b. Plan B includes removing countertop the get more access from above . If plan a and b fail, next is plan C. Wait for fall and head to regional Guru headquarters in Inverness Fl or Wittman Az, and hope someone is home........

[Richard]

This is going to be very interesting. Please take pics and post. This is a setup that I have not seen. It might be a good idea to start a new thread.

I love your approach, “what could go wrong”. It kind of sums up about everything I have learned about the RV world.